8th Nov 2022 AMPstigator Season Three Episode 40 Overcoming Scarcity
with Guest Dr. PaQuita Pullen
[00:00:00] < Intro >
Lauren: This is AMPstigator. A podcast founded on purpose, but focused on the path to get there. Experience is the best teacher, and in this season of AMPstigator we're going all in on female perspective of women and wisdom.
As we answer one specific question. What's the lesson here? You'll hear from my best girlfriends and favorite female collaborators. As we share deeply about what we're here to learn and teach, as we guide other women to purpose.
Welcome back to AMPstigator. I'm so excited to share this episode with you today because it's another viewpoint on life and the lessons we're always learning. Today you're going to meet Dr. PaQuita Pullen, who I absolutely adore because she's living on purpose, and you're going to feel that in this episode.
She's a therapist, and more than that, she's a doctor. She even talks about that like, "I'm a whole doctor." And it actually plays into today's lesson about how she's overcoming feelings of fear and scarcity. She's been a therapist for a long time and has been going to therapy, herself, for more than 10 years.
So that's part of the conversation we have today. About her having her PhD and how she, even, has to remind herself of that when she's feeling abundant or fully seeing her value. And I think it's such a powerful illustration of how so many of us can feel.
Because, sometimes, it doesn't matter what accomplishments we have. We can appear high-functioning to everybody else, and then we get home and it's like, "I'm breaking down." Or maybe we second guess ourselves, or our power, or our direction.
So I just really appreciate Dr. P coming in with her sass, and her sayings, and her wisdom. It's really fun because you're hearing life lessons from her point of view and she counsels people for a living.
So the way she narrates, the way she tells her personal stories are from a place of wholeness. And her stories have a therapeutic tinge to it, too, so you're always learning the whole time.
Dr. P also gets into why there needs to be more clinicians of color. I did not know this before our taping. Did you know 91% of therapists are white? Yes, African Americans make up just 4% of the therapist population. But in our actual population, they're nearly 15% of people in our country. So Dr. P talks about why she started a therapy practice geared toward minority populations. And why she's now putting her focus toward teaching and mentoring clinicians of color.
And make sure you listen all the way to the end, because I ask her, specifically, about whether she believes we as humans all need stillness. Or the way I asked it even was like, "Is this something that only I need or is this something that everybody needs?" And she's like, "Okay." You're going to hear her answer and her explanation, of how people experience stillness differently.
It's a conversation that's going to have you laughing a whole lot, for sure, LoL the whole time. But also you'll walk away feeling permission. Feeling permission for the things that you already are experiencing. Like it's okay to be the person you feel drawn to being.
And before we get started, make sure you're following AMPstigator on Instagram. You have to see Dr. P's silk pants, she showed up in my brand colors. So they're hot pink on one leg and hot orange on the other. All silk, it was fire. I loved it.
You can see Dr. P in her amazing pants as we post video clips from this conversation on the gram. So let's get into the episode. Here's Dr. PaQuita Pullen with the lesson, Overcoming Scarcity.
I think what you're doing with Ubuntu is fantastic. So I just want to start there, with the counseling center that you've created. Where your heart is on these issues with counseling people within a minority population. I just am obsessed with what you're doing, so I want to hear all about it.
PaQuita: Yes, thank you. Ubuntu is my baby. And, so, we are a private practice, and it started out with just me and my assistant a couple of years ago. It was actually I had a business called One Love Yoga. And then I realized that, that was limiting and only one part of who I am. I'm also a yoga instructor. And, so, I changed it and did the Ubuntu Counseling and Wellness.
Lauren: Yes, what does Ubuntu mean?
PaQuita: Ubuntu means, loosely, translated, "I am, because we are." So it really speaks to this notion, that we're all connected. And I came across it in this pin on Pinterest, where there was this notion that when someone in a tribe had a transgression, or mistake, or something that went against God, or morals-
Lauren: The culture.
PaQuita: ...or the culture, or things like that. That rather than criticizing or ridiculing, they would take the person out, surround them, and only remind them for like two days of all the good that they are.
Lauren: Wow.
PaQuita: Because they felt like when we make mistakes and when we have transgressions, it's usually due to we've forgotten who we are. So it's the tribe's responsibility, so to speak, to remind them.
Lauren: Yes, wow, and, so, you built an entire practice around this word. Of like, "I'm going to remind you of all the beautiful things that you are." And you address mental health in that way.
PaQuita: Absolutely, mirroring our humanity, that we are human.
Lauren: Yes, I love that. It's interesting to me that I didn't realize you were also a yoga instructor. So you were addressing the physical, but now with your practice, you're able to address the mental side of health.
PaQuita: Mind-body connect, which is really important. I always say that when you have a headache, and you're trying to do something you struggle. And you're just like, "Oh, this headache." It's the same if we're anxious.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: So there's such a connection between our mind, and our body, and those things that are going on. So we try to look at the whole person.
Lauren: Yes, what kind of whole person are you trying to address in your practice? I know you see anybody. You see everybody.
PaQuita: We do.
Lauren: But there was a very specific population that you're like, "This is who I need to help."
PaQuita: Yes, so our racial ethnic minorities. We are taking our healing so much seriously now, and I just want to pinpoint that. We have gotten for real about healing and growth. But we're still behind the curve, so to speak, when it comes to mental health and mental health disparities, and for lots of different reasons. Lack of education, lack of resources, lack of finances, lack of understanding, lack of clinicians of color.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And, so, my practice really was for those, and how I say it is, "We stand for the understood, unheard, misunderstood, unheard, and underrepresented."
Lauren: And who does that person look like? Paint the picture for who that person is.
PaQuita: Paint the picture. So that is the high-functioning, anxious Black woman who's getting all of these accolades at her job. But then she's going home and like breaking down, crying. Because there's nobody there to support her, but everyone is pulling off of her. It's for the Black man who has a lot of pain inside and no outlet. In order to be able to do that because he's supposed to be a man, and he's Black and Black men don't go to therapy.
Lauren: Yes, there's a toughness there.
PaQuita: There's a toughness there. It's for the teenager, who knows that something isn't right or something needs to be better in their family. But they're teenager so they don't have a voice. Even though their voice needs to be heard, it's often not heard because of where they are. So the unseen, unheard, and misunderstood, underestimated.
Lauren: Oh, I like that one, too, underestimated.
PaQuita: Yes, underestimated.
Lauren: Do you feel like in some ways some of that applied to you, in your own personal journey?
PaQuita: Absolutely, so my friends and I joke that I've been grown my whole life.
Lauren: Like you came out of the womb and started at 30.
PaQuita: Like I came out of the womb, and my mom will say the same thing. I always had this perspective, you know what I mean? About things. I've always been a person, it's not just what I see, it's what I don't see.
And I always remember I had to be like five or six and I was like, "You know, mom, if everybody became who they wanted to be when they grew up, the little things wouldn't get done." I wanted to be a firefighter. I wanted, my little small frame self, wanted to be a firefighter.
Lauren: Take on that a hundred pounds of gear.
PaQuita: But I was going to do it and, so, those types of things. And, so, just even myself, growing up, I'm a first generation college student, which came much later.
Lauren: And even more than that, you have your PhD.
PaQuita: I have my PhD.
Lauren: That's huge.
PaQuita: Yes, that is huge. But I was always a bookworm, always smart. When my siblings and cousins, I have lots of cousins, would be outside playing. I'd be snuggled under the table reading a book, I was a super nerd. I was like, "Nerds make money and make the world go around, though." We make the world go around. But I also grew up in some less than ideal circumstances. I had a ACE score of seven or eight.
Lauren: Which I know what that means, but I'm not sure other people would know. Please explain that.
PaQuita: So ACE is Adverse Childhood Experiences and, so, really trauma. To break it down, in simplest forms, there are certain traumas that we experience or can experience as children, that they have found can predict other issues later on, down the line.
Lauren: So, for example, a homeless child might have a super high score, as well, because maybe they've witnessed someone getting robbed, witness someone getting killed.
PaQuita: Yes, so witnessing trauma, experiencing trauma, growing up without both of your parents.
Lauren: That's true. I think my ACE score might be one. Mine is I've not had a lot of trauma growing up, there was very little. My trauma that I've experienced has been as an adult.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: But you had a higher score as a child.
PaQuita: A higher score as a child, which research says that even a ACE score of one puts you at the risk four times more likely to experience things like alcoholism, substance abuse. Which I'm very blessed and honored to say that I have never struggled with those things.
Lauren: And that's a gift.
PaQuita: So the thing that comes out of the ACEs research is that it takes one consistent stable person in your life, to change that trajectory. And, so, for me, schooling and my teachers really filled in the gap a lot of times, with dealing with some of those childhood things, for sure.
Lauren: That's amazing. And, so, at what point did you say, "I need to be this person. I need to be a counselor for other people, I need to help them."
Lauren: Yes, so it's actually quite interesting, because I get that question. And, so, I graduated from MTSU with my bachelor's degree, and went in the first two years undeclared. I didn't really have a major, I didn't know what I was going to do, and then I call it a mini breakdown.
And I was in my little on-campus apartment and I had a mini breakdown. I don't even know what triggered it, at this point, but I just started writing, just writing. And the next day I said, "Oh, I'm going to go declare my major as a psychology major and I'm going to go be a therapist."
Lauren: Wow.
PaQuita: To this day, I cannot find that notebook. I don't know what happened to it.
Lauren: Oh, man.
PaQuita: I don't know what I wrote, but I really think it was a God thing or like this cathartic thing. But I think in that moment and after that release, it was like, "I don't want other people to feel alone."
Lauren: Were you 20? How old were you?
PaQuita: I had to be, probably, 20, my birthday is weird. I graduated at 17 and started college at 17. So I'm a September baby, but, yes, I probably had to be around like 20, and I'd never even considered anything else at that point. You know what I mean? It was like-
Lauren: "This is what I'm going to do."
PaQuita: "This is what I'm going to do." And I think I had always, like I said, been perceptive. So there were things that I would call out and things that I would say, and I will be honest, at 20, I did not have a lot of tact. I'm still a straight shooter, but now I know how to shoot straight with a little tact.
Lauren: Yes, you put some sugar on it.
PaQuita: Well, a little sweetener. And, so, I think that caused a lot of ruptures and caused a lot of confusion about me, and my purpose, and what I needed to be doing. But it's like I decided and that was that.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: I graduated May of 2010, the weekend of the floods for those Nashvillians like me.
Lauren: Oh, wow, and that was a 1000-year flood, the 2010 floods here in Nashville.
PaQuita: Yes, during my graduation weekend. But I was at Murphysboro so we were not as impacted, we did have some of that, and then I started grad school 2011.
Lauren: I find it interesting that you say that there aren't many clinicians of Color. Do you know the stats on that? Or is it mostly White women or what are we seeing?
PaQuita: You are correct. So what we're seeing and I do think that it's shifting and changing. But it's about 4% African American, about 4% Hispanic American, and probably like 1% Asian and Pacific Islander, and the rest is White, typically more females, but-
Lauren: So 91% White in terms of clinician makeup, wow.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: When you were in your classes, were you the only person who looked like you?
PaQuita: So in my cohort I was actually pretty lucky. It was actually five of us in my cohort, but that is rare.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: It was actually a rare occasion. Usually it's one, maybe two per cohort. So at the university I went to, we used the cohort model. And, so, yes, my program, it was kind of unheard of.
Lauren: So in your practice now, I mean, you're very clear on the populations that you really want to serve because they are underserved populations. Are you hearing from people who walk in your door or sit down in the room with you. "There's just been no one for me to connect with and no one to talk to. Or no one who looks like me, I don't feel heard or seen." Are those conversations you hear, that you have?
PaQuita: So we do hear that. Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off.
Lauren: You're good, girl, I was just saying, are these conversations you hear and that you have?
PaQuita: Yes, these are absolutely conversations that we hear. This is what I find interesting, my very first client at Ubuntu was actually a White woman.
Lauren: Wow.
PaQuita: Who identifies as a lesbian. But she came and she said, "I want a Black clinician because all of the times that I've needed somebody to be real and be honest, and really give me what I needed it's was from a Black woman."
And I was like, "Come on in here, Sis, take a seat because I will get you together." And I did, she's is still with me. She's actually still with me with, she was the very first session. And she still comes to me like every month, but we definitely hear that.
I have had clients that were like, "Oh, my gosh, I have been looking for a Black therapist. I have been looking for a therapist of Color." I have a couple that's told me, I had to transition because I got my doctorate and moving to more of other things like counselling education.
Lauren: Yes, you've moved your counselling and you've moved to practice as well.
PaQuita: You moved the practice and all of that. And I'm moving more towards teaching practice as well. So many clinicians of Color don't have mentors of Color because there's not a lot of counselor educators of Color in these programs. I had one Black professor doing my master's program, and she was actually an adjunct faculty, she was not even full-time. She later served on my dissertation committee, all right.
Lauren: Oh, wow.
PaQuita: But that's what you see a lot of the time, is because it's so rare for us to be able to find someone in the field that looks like us. So I'm kind of transitioning to do that. But I hear that from future clinicians of Color and you hear it from clients about, "This is what I'm needing and why." And it's a real gift to be able to validate that for them, as well, to say that that's okay.
Lauren: Yes, well, I mean and that's what you're doing. And, so, much of your practice is validation. It's the listening, it's the validation, it's the questioning. Like you were saying earlier, before we even pressed record, you said, "We don't cancel people we counsel people."
PaQuita: Absolutely.
Lauren: And that's so much of what you're doing.
PaQuita: Yes, for sure.
Lauren: I just love that. Tell me about your approach. How you see your role as a therapist? Do you see it as, "I'm a listener."
Do you see it as, "I'm a validator?" How do you describe what you do?
PaQuita: Yes, so I'm all of that, but I'm what my client needs me to be in the moment.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: But what's really funny is, well one, I'm authentic. I'm an authentic counselor. If I don't know how to help you, I will say, "I don't know how to help you, but I'll figure it out." I'm like, "We'll figure it out." But I'm like, "I don't know."
But I'm real, and I tell them in my intakes, "What you see in me is what shows up." So I'm honest with them. I'm authentic with them. It's really funny, and any of my clients who ends up seeing this when it comes out, they dubbed me as the wig-snatching therapist.
Lauren: What does that mean?
PaQuita: So the wig-snatching therapist means that when you come to me, and they're like, "You didn't have to read me."
Or, "You did not have to tell my whole life like that."
Or, "You did not have to get me together like that. I'm not ready to address these things." You know what I mean?
Lauren: Like, you call them out.
PaQuita: I call them out. I call them out to the carpet. But every last one of my clients know that I'm calling you out, and I'm right there with you.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And we're going to like clean you up, and shake you off, and change your trajectory, and then send you on your way. So I always tell them, "We have to snatch your wig, and then we can put it back on straight." They told me that and I thought that was too funny. And they were like, "Because, yes, you get us together." But I think just being able to confront them with those things that they have been experiencing, and those types of things, and helping them see that there's another way.
Lauren: Yes, I didn't realize until, probably, this year... I think like outside looking in, for someone who's listening, who maybe has never seen a therapist or doesn't have a committed relationship with someone who's a mental health professional.
Maybe you have the same misunderstanding that I had which was, that you see a therapist and every therapist is the same. Or you have one person and, then, you're going to have a connection with them right off the bat. That's just not the case.
PaQuita: No.
Lauren: You have to find someone who gets you, who you get, who you trust, who you love, I would say immediately. Because I'm someone who just feels things immediately.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: So, for me, it's like I had to, with the woman I'm with now who's my therapist and my gift from God, she is amazing. I felt in the first time meeting her, I'm like, "You are my person. You are who I need to be with."
Conversely, I had another situation many months ago. Where I met, one time, with this therapist and I left, and I'm like, "This is not my person." But I thought, "Maybe therapy is not for me." Is what I actually left thinking
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: Because really what it was is that person just wasn't my person.
PaQuita: Absolutely.
Lauren: So talk to me about that. The importance of finding someone who's your person, who you get, who gets you.
PaQuita: Absolutely, and you're right, sometimes it does happen right off the bat, and that's great. But that's not the case for everyone. But I'm going to say that's a myth that, "Therapy is not for me." Therapy is for everyone. I'm a therapist and I have a therapist. My therapist got me through grad school, they'll get me through all these next journeys and different things like that.
Lauren: Business ownership.
PaQuita: Yes, I think that there's also this thing, not only with "This is not my person, but therapy is not for me. I'm not that bad to get therapy." But life is rough, and we need all of the supports that we can get.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: So I always tell people start with three referrals, doing consultations. Go meet with them. See how you feel, if they don't work, you mark them off your list and you find three more people. And you don't stop until you find that person that you really do feel like you can connect with.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: The other thing I'll say, to your point, is that sometimes just like anything, you have a therapist that takes you a certain place, and that's what they're great for. And then you need something different.
Lauren: Yes, for your next stage of growth.
PaQuita: For your next stage of growth. My current therapist is actually an Asian American therapist, but my first therapist was White and she helped me a lot. She helped me and we dropped in and there was a lot of key things that I learned from her.
Lauren: Mm-hmm.
PaQuita: But then, at some point, in my growth and the things that I needed. I knew that I needed or wanted a minority therapist to be able to process other things surrounding ethnic identity, and dismantling these systems. And how oppression likes to hide behind words like professionalism, and just different things like that. So, yes, just keep going.
I'm like you in the sense where I can feel immediately, and I've been very blessed to be able to do that. But if that's not people's jam. I always like to use metaphors, I'm actually a huge metaphor person. And, so, one of the things, and I guess this is for the ladies out there. But our favorite pair of jeans, there is nothing like our favorite pair of jeans.
Lauren: True.
PaQuita: The ones that hug you in all the right places.
Lauren: They lift you where you need.
PaQuita: And they lift and tuck where you need. But we don't stop until we find those perfect pair of jeans because it's important to us. Or getting our hair done, or our nails, or, to the fells, those sneakers, or those joggers, all of the things.
Everyone, regardless of gender, race, we have these things that are important to us and we don't stop until we get what we want, until we get what we need. So, sometimes, I think people think like, "It's not for me, I don't need it." Because we learn that when our needs aren't met, sometimes, we're just like, "Well, then the needs don't matter." But what you want to do is you find a different way to get the needs met.
Lauren: Mm. This whole season is about lessons. I feel like we're all connected, and especially as women, there's so many things that we each deal with. That once you have gone through it, in your life, you are qualified to teach on this subject.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: And, so, I want to know from your perspective, what is a lesson that you either consistently are learning, all the time, that it just keeps coming up? Or is there a lesson that you're learning in real time that you want to talk about today?
PaQuita: Yes, oh, I knew it was coming. When you say it I'm like, "Oh, get a little shimmy in the shoulders." So I would say my lesson is kind of both, one that I feel like I have to keep learning over and over again. But one that I'm also learning in real time, and I would say, as we've talked, is living in abundance.
Lauren: Mh-hmm.
PaQuita: Living in abundance in all areas, not just some areas. Not just your bank account and really not even anything materialistically, but as a person.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: Showing up as a full person in spite of. When we've talked earlier about my ACEs scores that teaches you, in some ways, to be in survival mode, or to operate out of scarcity. And then I am a therapist and so a lot of times I'm reaching down in the depths to pull people up.
So I'm kind of surrounded by this lack, pretty often, it's a job hazard, or product job, work product, as we say. And it's not a bad thing, but you don't start to realize how limited. And, so, for me, it's really about learning that line between limited and limitless.
Lauren: I mean, I would feel like it's more than a line, it's a chasm.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: I mean like this is a deep divide to get yourself from one side of that Grand Canyon to the other, it's big.
PaQuita: Yes, so, just living. And I think there's a theory about abundance, too. There's theory of like, "This is what it means to be abundant and this is what abundance looks like, but then practice."
And, so, sometimes, you can have a theory, but it doesn't show up or translate into practice. Or sometimes you can have a practice, but it's not backed up by theory. You know what I mean? So really learning how to pull those, both, together to make them closer and more in tandem rather than either or, is what I'm learning.
Lauren: Tell me how it's fleshed out in your life. So that's big picture, abundance, how it plays out. Give me specifics where this is coming through in your life for you.
PaQuita: Yes, specific, so being here. Being so happy to be here, I think I've said that already. I can, honestly, say that today when I woke up, I was like, "Okay, it's time to go be a badass. It's time to go show up, and it's time for me to get out there, and I'm going to go, and I'm going to speak, and I'm going to speak from a place of wholeness.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: But a few months ago, if you would've asked me to do this. I probably would've been like, "Oh, I don't want to be on camera. I don't want people to see me."
Lauren: Mm-hmm.
PaQuita: So it's like, "Yes, I'll be a badass over here where the lights are shining somewhere different." So that, I think...
Lauren: Or maybe you'll be bad in the shadows, but you didn't want to be bad in the lights.
PaQuita: Oh, yes, I'm bad in the shadows. But learning how to do that. I think learning, especially, even transitioning and now that I'm a doctor, and realizing that, "Yes, I'm still a therapist, I will always be a therapist." But then realizing like, I'm not a Master's-level therapist anymore, I'm a doctoral level therapist and what that means-
Lauren: Yes, stepping into that, embracing all the things that you are
PaQuita: Stepping into that, embracing in that, and saying, when someone says, "Do I call you PaQuita or Dr. P?" And saying, "Dr. P." Because that's abundance for me. You know what I mean?
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: So learning how to really walk in this with this new title. But not even just the title, but the responsibility that I hold pretty near and dear to my heart about that.
Lauren: Yes, you earned that.
PaQuita: I earned it and it's also what's going to help me or what is helping me walk alongside other people. So Ubuntu, like really living that Ubuntu, so I think that. My relationship, I love my man so much.
Lauren: I met him and he's so cute.
PaQuita: I know he's cute.
Lauren: And he's got this swagger, this suave, he's cute.
PaQuita: I know, girl, thank you.
Lauren: I know, I met him and I was like, "He's cool. Very QG, he's got this vibe. He's a whole vibe.
PaQuita: Yes, he is a whole vibe. But how I've been showing up in my relationship with him, and expecting the best from him. Which he is so happy to give and I'm so happy to give, but that helps me give my best to him. You know what I mean? And, so, there's a trend, right now, going on called Black Girl Softness, I don't know if you've heard about it?
Lauren: I don't, tell me about it.
Lauren: So Black Girl Softness is, and my dissertation was on the strong Black woman. Like never let them see you sweat. You can take it and you do what you need to do, at all costs.
Lauren: Like the high-functioning woman you were talking about earlier.
PaQuita: Like the high-functioning woman. And, so, we're shifting that to what we call Black Girl Softness. It's delicate, ask for help. Go hang out with your man, the presentation can wait.
Lauren: That's like allowing the feminine. The feminine/masculine energies, it's allow step into the feminine.
PaQuita: Really allowing ourselves to do that. And, so, learning what abundance looks like as a partner. You know what I mean? Not expecting the cleanup or like, "Oh, my gosh, I'm so stressed. Thank you for being here."
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: But it's all of it.
Lauren: That feels like a codependency, almost, like saying in that way of like, "Ah, I can't manage it, but you're here and you can do it, and you can do it for me and I need you."
PaQuita: Well, and then getting mad, when he doesn't do it, that's the codependency part. We call it rescue control or fix. And then you feel victimized because they didn't do it, and now you're angry, and upset, and resentful. And you just keep bouncing in this triangle, so to speak. But also being this strong black woman, that's also foreign.
So it's where do you find the line between being self-sufficient and, I can get it, and being soft. So that's really playing out, especially, in this new phase that I'm at. How to have an abundant relationship?
My niece and nephew, who are also my favorite people, what abundance is their auntie looks like. They love their auntie. My nephew said, "Auntie, can I just go everywhere with you all of the time?"
Lauren: How old is he?
PaQuita: He just turned four.
Lauren: Oh, my heart.
PaQuita: And my niece will be seven on Saturday.
Lauren: Oh, my God.
PaQuita: So I'll give her birthday shout out. So when she turns 18, she'll see that her auntie loves her, but showing up in those ways.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: Even my look, that's another thing, trying to exude abundance in how I look. I've often been told that I just have this light about me, and it's like people just want to plug into you. People just want to be around you; you light up a room.
Lauren: Yes, that's a gift, by the way.
PaQuita: Thank you.
Lauren: That is something you can't teach someone that, you are born with that.
PaQuita: Yes, thank you.
Lauren: I hope you know that, right? You're born with that.
PaQuita: Yes, that's what I'm learning.
Lauren: That was a gift you were given to go through life.
PaQuita: And, so, I think even that abundance is being able to see that as a gift, and not as this responsibility that it has previously felt like. It's like, "Okay, everybody's plugging into me. But like, "Don't plug into me, I'm trying to chill over here. I'm trying to get something else done."So being that light even when hard things happen. Even when nobody would blame me for turning inward and cutting the light off or anything like that. So, yes, was that specific enough?
Lauren: Yes, I love that. I love that, because the way I see each of these episodes is like you come in, you, you being any guest. You come in, you teach your lesson. You talk about what it is that you're learning and whoever's listening at home, they get to learn from your perspective, what it means to be you or what it means to feel this way.
PaQuita: Absolutely.
Lauren: And I feel like we don't have to learn all the lessons ourselves. God help us, if we all had to go through all the lessons, that would be awful.
PaQuita: It would be.
Lauren: But if I can learn a lesson and I can teach it, and then you can learn a lesson and you can teach it. And this person can learn, and this person this person, and then we share all of those lessons. Maybe I'm learning a lesson that's for someone else.
PaQuita: Absolutely.
Lauren: And they're hearing it and they're going "That's what I needed to hear." That's what this podcast is about.
PaQuita: Absolutely.
Lauren: So me asking you like-
PaQuita: You got Ubuntu down, girl.
Lauren: I got it.
PaQuita: You got Ubuntu down. You got the little honorary Ubuntu.
Lauren: I can be in the tribe.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: I can be an elder in the tribe. But you know what I mean? To me, that's what it's about. It's about being able to show people that we can do this together. I can teach you, I can learn from you, and I can save you heartache, just listen to my story. I can save you heartache.
PaQuita: Absolutely.
Lauren: Or I've been there and here's how it fleshed out in my life, and here's what I learned and here's how I'm highly functioning since then. You know what I mean?
PaQuita: Mm-hmm, absolutely. There's a strength that you also learn that comes with that softness as well, but it's this silent, gentle strength. But I think that when you are coming from a place of abundance, and it doesn't mean that those things aren't there. You know what I mean? I'm fully aware that if I don't pay the rent-
Lauren: Or you don't make money.
PaQuita: Or that I don't make money and all of those things. But it's not allowing those things to define how you move. And, so, one of the things I love about AMPstigator, which I know you're probably going to get to that, is purpose. But if you show up in purpose, everything else will align.
Lauren: Yes, and purpose is something that you have to feel. You have to feel it through your heart. You can't think your way into purpose, it's just not.
PaQuita: Absolutely, and it's yours.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And, so, the thing is you can't be talked into it, but you also can't be talked out of it.
Lauren: Right, because if this is your path, I mean, it's just your role to embrace it and move forward.
PaQuita: And listen, you were going to walk that path, you were going to walk it. You were going to walk it.
Lauren: I'm just curious, do people ever come to you asking about purpose or is that like an underlying thing? "I just feel like I need meaning?" And maybe what are the words that you hear from people?
PaQuita: Absolutely, I mean, I think that sometimes it's like an underlying thing. But what I hear, when it comes to purpose, really, it's a lot of helping people unlearn. Most people don't really need to learn what their purpose is, if that makes sense.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: Because I think you are born with that. I think it is a gift, and I think it's those things that you don't know how you know, but you know that you know.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And you know, something that other people don't know. But it's a lot of unlearning, meaning our social conditioning.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: Our survival techniques, our trauma, our disappointments, our unhealthy relationships, our less than ideal family situations. All of those things, sometimes, can get in the way and really muddy what people think is their purpose or what they deem to be as their purpose. So a lot of times it's really getting in it with them and saying, "Oh, wait a minute, but is that your voice or is that someone else's voice?"
Lauren: That's right.
PaQuita: And, so, one of my favorite things that I like to offer to my clients, and I'll offer to anyone. Is don't make choices based on consequences that other people aren't going to have to deal with.
Lauren: Mm-hmm.
PaQuita: So it's easy for me to say, "Hey, Lauren, no, don't do that, girl. You need to stop this." And you might do that, but then you have to deal with the consequences of not being in purpose, I don't. You know what I mean?
Lauren: Yes, no, you're right.
PaQuita: And, so, I think that's always really something that I try to hone in with people, all of the time. It's like, "People will understand, the impact will come, the income will come, acceptance will come. But it always starts sometimes with just being in purpose and trusting it for yourself."
Lauren: I love that, though, that being a barometer. The consequences being a barometer. Does this person face the consequence or do you? But it probably does get a little muddy because in some ways, I'm just thinking about a situation so that you can have my hypothetical.
What if I do something and my parents say, and I'm a grown woman but please believe, and my parents say, "Don't do that, blah, blah, blah." Even as me as an adult, I'm fully going to take consequences. But don't they also, in some ways, take consequences. If the consequence is let's just say shame, for example, or disapproval, don't they also receive a part of the consequence?
PaQuita: I mean, they could but we are also, as much as we are connected we are also individuals. You know what I mean? So to speak. And, so, it's still their responsibility to manage their consequences for themselves. Because even though they may feel shame, let's just say that, but that's probably their stuff and still not yours.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: Does that make sense?
Lauren: Oh, yes, it makes total sense. Gosh, the first time I ever learned that lesson, actually, I was 25 and learning-
PaQuita: 25 is a good age.
Lauren: 25?
PaQuita: It's rough, but it's good.
Lauren: I'm just going to tell you my 20s sucked. So if it was good for you, great. Things got better for me at about 27, and then things started getting better. But good lord, my 20s, oh, they were bad.
And not for any decisions I made, it was like just one after the next. Like get kicked down, get treated like crap, everywhere you turn. Like the world was against me, that's what my 20s felt like, it felt horrible.
PaQuita: 20s are a time of transition, for sure. I'm probably saying it was a good age because I'm far removed from 25, now. It doesn't look like it, but you know what I mean? But I'm far removed now. But it is a time of transition but go ahead, I'm sorry.
Lauren: Yes, but 25 was the first time I'd ever realized that someone can put something on you, that's not yours.
PaQuita: That's not yours.
Lauren: That was the first time. And I think of it like, you say you got metaphors, I do too. I do a lot of, "This is how I see this."
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: Think of when you've got necklaces that are all tangled, and you've got like a rat's nest of necklaces.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: That's what my emotions were. That's what all the conditioning was, the expectation, all that was like that rat's nest.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: I had to spend time untangling the necklaces. To where I could get them as nice and straight, and realize, "Oh, this is my emotion, but that's their expectation, that's their projection, that's their problem." It was hard.
PaQuita: It is so hard, and I think that's the other thing too. When I get clients that are coming in and things like that. It's like, "This is going to be hard."
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: But I say, "But what's also hard is living the way that you're living right now, and being on this hamster wheel."
Lauren: Mm-hmm.
PaQuita: So we have to choose between which hurt we're going to go. And, so, we might as well choose the hurt-
Lauren: The hurt that brings healing.
PaQuita: ...that's going to bring healing and take us where we need to go, and where we're headed. But, absolutely, you do start to realize we are products of our environment. If we are connected, which you and I both believe deeply, then that also means that sometimes we're plugged in to some things that are not always the healthiest, or the brightest, or those things.
So we have to shift, and be able to make that transition sometimes to say, "Oh, no, that's not mine." And what you find, going back to abundance, is that sometimes people put their scarcity on you.
Lauren: A 100%.
PaQuita: And now it snuggled up to you because it needs just a little mustard seed. You know how we say, "Faith of a mustard seed." I say it needs fear of a mustard seed, that scarcity mindset, it just needs a little bit and it snuggles up. And then you are denying yourself things that are well within your right, your birth right to have.
Lauren: Yes, and within your power.
PaQuita: And within your power. So I, recently, just bought me a new car, a luxury car.
Lauren: Good for you.
PaQuita: I love my little car, it floats. So that's another thing like abundance, but I was like, "No, I don't need to get this and I don't need to do this, and blah, blah, blah." And then I sat and I was like, "I'm a whole doctor."
Lauren: "I'm a whole doctor."
PaQuita: Not a half of a doctor, "I'm a whole doctor." I know how to do a budget, this is well within my means,
Lauren: This is fine, I can do this.
PaQuita: But for so long, you know what I mean? just that make smart decisions. Don't do this, don't do that, and all of those things. And having to realize like, "Wait a minute, I have surpassed some of these limits to where some of those things were relevant at the time, but I'm not there anymore."
Lauren: God, you don't know this, but you are actually speaking to me right now. This is what, I'm telling you, I'm learning this lesson in real time. On Friday, so just a handful of days ago on Friday, I learned this lesson.
The same one that you just named, where I'm in the middle of a contract negotiation. We just settled on money moving forward, at the television station. So you deal with money, then you deal with terms. And I am not going to lie, y'all, I've been driving a 21-year-old car, with 220,000 miles.
PaQuita: It's time, Lauren.
Lauren: In the same way, and my husband even says to me, he's like, "When the hell are you going to get yourself?" He's like, "This is not about image, not at all." He's like, "That car's going to break down on you and going to leave you stranded."
And he's like, "And I'm going to help you, but then I'm going to laugh." Because for all this time, and please believe I also have my budget. I also know I have more than enough to buy myself a car. And I was, literally, on Friday saying-
PaQuita: Same, I had a Rogue before this, and I loved my Rogue, I did. I rode it till the wheels fell off. Right now it's sitting in the driveway on a flat. I rode it, I traveled with it, and all of those things. But like you said, just realizing why-
Lauren: Why have I done this? It is truly living in scarcity.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: And that's how it's been for me. And I realize, for so long, and this was just probably also back to my 20s, in those formative years of starting my career, and there wasn't enough. So, yes, I did have to be really careful about what I spent and that sort of thing. I am so far past that point, years past that point.
PaQuita: But you forget, I think that's the tricky thing about scarcity, too. It's like, "Okay, I don't have enough." But we don't check back in with it, and see how it's expanded. It just says, "Oh, you still don't have enough."
Lauren: Well, and I've been conditioning myself to think that it's not a scarcity issue. What it is, "I'm being smart. I'm being an adult. I'm taking care, I'm thinking long term here. I'm being practical." I am someone who, just in life, I am practical, sometimes, practical to a fault.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: But I think I've allowed some of my practicality to actually become scarcity, and I look at this car situation. And, literally, I learned this lesson on Friday, a few days ago. And we cannot learn lessons until we ourselves learn them. It doesn't matter what other people say to us, we have to be ready.
PaQuita: You have to be online.
Lauren: You have to be online for that lesson, and I was online on Friday. It was the realization of like, "No, I really have more than enough. I don't need to be concerned about this." And, so, I downloaded an app and started searching for cars, and maybe next time I see you, Dr. P-
PaQuita: Yes, you'll have a new car.
Lauren: ...I will not have a 22-year-old car with 220,000 miles. When you think about the image of me, that is not what you think or, right?
PaQuita: No, not at all, especially, not a 20-something-old car. But I think even that in some ways scarcity also showed up in, I talk about how sometimes our transformation can be a threat to others.
Lauren: Girl, you're so right.
PaQuita: Meaning our relationships with other people-
Lauren: Your close relationships too.
PaQuita: Your close relationships. And, so, how scarcity was showing up for me, a little bit, was like, "Well, is somebody going to think I'm better than them? Are they going to think like, 'Oh, she's a doctor now, and, now, she thinks she's blah, blah, blah.'" All of the things.
And, so, my man, that I love, was like, "Why do you want this car?" And I really just didn't even have a full answer form at the time. But then I was riding in that car, and he's very practical, too, you all would bond very-
Lauren: So he'd be like, "I love your 22-year-old Corolla."
PaQuita: He probably would, "Is it still running?"
Lauren: Yes, that's right.
PaQuita: It's so funny, he's going to hate me for this. But one time I said something, I'm like, "I want you to be more romantic, come on. What can we do?"
And he's like, "Paying bills is romantic."
PaQuita: And I'm like, "Well, it is all right, thank you."
Lauren: "Honey, I took care of this."
PaQuita: Making his money is romantic. But he has grown very good in that, but that practical. And, so, for him, it's never a no, "You can't have." But he always just wants to understand.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And I was like, "But this is for me, as my symbol of the promises and the hard work." You know what I mean? And it's the promises over my life.
Lauren: That became a mindfulness tool,
PaQuita: And I mean, I'm just driving and it had nothing to do with anybody. When I'd get in that car, and I love it just as much as I loved my Rogue. But it was symbolic, for me, and to take notice, and to take stock, of what that felt like.
Lauren: Yes, totally. And then I do love that, and I do think the word mindfulness gets thrown around too much, and I don't want it to feel cliche. However, when you step into that car, you feel that, and that's a reminder to you, which then becomes a mindfulness tool. That's a reminder for you that you are abundant.
PaQuita: You're right, mindfulness is just paying attention on purpose. Paying attention on purpose, not missing those little moments that come up, that are trying to tell you something.
Lauren: Oh, I love that. I love how you make that so simple.
PaQuita: Paying attention on purpose.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: That's one of my specialties, and people say that to me. They're like, "How did you make this so simple?"
Lauren: Oh, that's also a gift." And let me reflect to you for a moment.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: As you're not maybe seeing yourself as clearly. Because I do feel like we all have blindness when it comes to self.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: So it requires the stillness of a still waters on the other side. A nice little mirror, to get a real reflection. People don't just have that ability, that is something that is a gift. So when we start putting our gifts together, that I feel like is also part of what creates this beautiful picture of purpose.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: An ability to take something that is actually very complex and simplify it to the point that others can understand it.
PaQuita: Yes, thank you.
Lauren: You do that, girl.
PaQuita: Thank you.
Lauren: I want to stay on this idea of scarcity. Because I wonder, in that same hypothetical that woman that you described, earlier in our conversation, you said a high-functioning, Black woman who is doing great and getting whatever. Maybe she's getting all these accolades in the public eye, but then is losing it when she's alone.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: I'm wondering how much that woman deals with scarcity.
PaQuita: Yes, I think, for me, and I can speak to me with that, is that I didn't realize that it was scarcity. Because I had all of these strategies and all of these things in place that hid it, so to speak. And it messes with your brain just as much, but I think it keeps that high-functioning, so to speak. So what it does, or what it did, for me, was it kept me so hyper focused on the responsibility of being high-functioning. And like, "Okay, I got to show up and I got to do this."
Lauren: It was pressure there.
PaQuita: And it was draining, and it wasn't fulfilling, and it wasn't sustaining. You know what I mean? There was just all of these different types of things that were going on. But it's like, "But I got what I prayed for, I got a condo. Oh, everybody thinks I'm so great." But then when you're at home by yourself and not reflecting that for yourself, and you're like, "Who am I? How do I just be? If I stop high-functioning, what is going to be left?" And that's a real fear.
Lauren: I've dealt with that. I still deal with that.
PaQuita: And, so, I think that I was starting to get bogged down, and that's what brings a lot of high functioning women to counseling. It's like you know that you were going to be a badass, so to speak, but something isn't clicking.
You don't have the energy. You don't have the matters of your heart aren't showing through, and you're just living day-to-day to get by. And, again, that's scarcity doing just enough so that people don't peek behind the curtain.
Lauren: "Here is the smoke. Don't look, don't find me out."
PaQuita: "Here is the smoke, don't look." Or that they just say, "Hey, I've had enough." You know what I mean? "I've had enough." And, so, not asking for help, not asking for those things. And one thing I started realizing as I started shifting out of that, is I'm like, "Who am I to deny other people their purpose?"
Maybe that was their purpose in that moment, to do something for me, but I let my own scarcity block that. And, so, for me, that was something that helped me undo it. Who am I to block people from-
Lauren: The blessing?
PaQuita: ...from the blessing.
Lauren: If they want to bless you?
PaQuita: Right, who am I? And, so, we always say, "Oh, I want to be blessed." I want abundance but then we get in our own way, so to speak. And I think for high-functioning people, getting in your own way is just another form of scarcity.
Lauren: This is something that I only just, this year, started learning. And I feel like when you, for me, and I'm 37. So when you spend 37 years doing, seeing life one way or functioning one way. And then you start realizing, "Hey, there's a different way, there's a healthier way, and I need to challenge some of my thinking on this." That's not just you make a decision one day and it's, "Are we good?" It's not like that.
PaQuita: Not at all.
Lauren: It's a constant thing. So just even hearing you say this, I'm like, "This is my reminder today."
PaQuita: For sure, I was just reading something, and it was, actually, I'm teaching a course right now on death and dying. But we were talking about giving the bereaved people permission to backslide. And, so, I love my students, so we've had really good conversations, not just about death and dying as far as individuals, we as individuals' death and dying.
But our expectations, our dreams, our ways of being, all of these different types of things. And, so, I think these lessons, some days you're like, "I got it." And then something happens and you backslide, or you forget. When you buy this car, because it's happening, it's already done.
Lauren: It's going to happen. I actually, here's the funny thing is I already see the car, I know what it is.
PaQuita: It's done.
Lauren: It's done.
PaQuita: But then you get it and then you click off of it and you like, "Okay, I'm not ready to to buy it yet." And then you go back to it and you click on it. I did that three times with my car. So I might be projecting, but I did. And I clicked off and I was like, "Oh, I'm not ready." And then I went back to it and then finally I was like, "Just do it." But I think that's also how you show up, that mindfulness that you mentioned earlier, is when you pay attention on purpose, you can pivot pretty sooner, you know what I mean?
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And, so, I think purpose is not a destination, abundance is not a destination, these are processes.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: The abundance and the purpose are the product.
Lauren: Totally.
PaQuita: But we want to be process-oriented and not necessarily product-oriented.
Lauren: You are speaking my language. Have you listened to all my episodes?
PaQuita: I have not. I guess you and I have some catching up to do girl.
Lauren: I know, I got a huge back catalog, Dr. P, you can listen through.
Lauren: Well, when I met you, it's so funny, you remember when we met. Because Dr. P and I haven't even known each other very long. I met her because she was receiving an award for the work that she's done, and I just happened to be emceeing this event, from another beloved former podcast guests Charlie Nelson.
Who's one of the founders of Nelson's Greenbrier Distillery here in Nashville, and he's got an awesome story. And, so, I love those guys. He and his brother who started that, and I love to support them.
They give an award every year to three women who are just basically doing incredible things. Making change, propping up the community in just an incredible way. And, so, I was emceeing that awards and that's when I met you. And I knew within a couple minutes, I'm like, "Wow, you're my kind of people. You are mine, we belong together, Dr. P.
PaQuita: We were just sitting there just chatting and you were like, "Yes, come on my podcast."
I'm like, "Yes, I'm going to come." And then you ended up emailing me and I was like, "Oh, she really emailed me."
Lauren: Oh, I don't blow smoke. If I'm saying something, it's real.
PaQuita: I know, it's not that. I don't either, but I think I was like, "All right, let's do it." So, yes, absolutely.
Lauren: And then you found the pants and you're like, "With this silk pants."
PaQuita: I the pants. I'm telling you, I really did, I saw them because I bought them maybe a few weeks ago. And I kept saying, "I need to go get them hemmed." And I was like, "Oh, my gosh, it's Tuesday, I got to get these hemmed." And I did.
Lauren: This is #shortgirlproblems, isn't it? Like, "I know girl."
PaQuita: It is, and somebody was like, "Oh, you can just put a heel on with them." And I was like, "No, not these."
Lauren: And I think you, I mean, for me, I'm at a certain age where I'm like, "I only wear heels if I have to."
PaQuita: Oh, yes.
Lauren: It has to be 'Have to'.
PaQuita: Have to, yes.
Lauren: There has to be a significant reason why because otherwise I'm in flats. I'm too old fo that
PaQuita: Yes, so, I'll add this, too. So I actually, recently, someone else had done like a profile story on me, and it was actually quite triggering for me. I'll be completely honest about that, and not at all what I expected. And I remember and I mean this, literally, just happened last week, it's just speaking to that backsliding.
Lauren: Was it the interview or was it reading the product that triggered?
PaQuita: I think it was the way that it was written. And I think it was maybe one of those moments where as it was happening I knew, but maybe I didn't speak up the way I thought that I did, so to speak.
Lauren: Okay, I see that.
PaQuita: And, so, I didn't like the way, I felt like I was portrayed like as a victim.
Lauren: Oh.
PaQuita: I mean, I am a victim and I'm a survivor, I think we have that equally, but I didn't like that. But neither here or there. It really just reminded, after I came out of my shame spiral, like we said, backsliding, like, "Oh, my gosh, people are going to know this about me. What are they going to think?" And it just really reminded me of how important it is for us to take control of our narrative. And to make sure that we're sharing our narratives, with people that can honor your narratives.
Lauren: Mm-hmm.
PaQuita: So I say all that to say, days of processing this, and someone goes, "Well, this is probably going to change how you review journalists, and reporters, and all of that." And in the back of my mind, I was like, "No, because me and Lauren, we're about to kick it."
And, so, I just want to reflect back to you and I guess do my human thing, but also my therapist thing is, thank you for being able to create this space where you can honor people's story and give them space to take control of those narratives. So I feel this was never in question.
Lauren: Oh, thank you.
PaQuita: It was never in question whether or not I was going to show up even with that very recent traumatic thing. So I was filled with joy to be here today and no, there was no scarcity. I knew that this was going to be authentic conversation, and that we were going to be able to move forward. But have that space with me sharing my narrative and that you have what it takes to hold the space for that. So thank you for that.
Lauren: Girl, what an honor. I feel really seen right now because truly even the way that you're describing what I do, that's how I describe it. Because I look at it as like, "Well, I have my story, but you have your story." Some of it comes down to the way in which a person asks questions. I see this with young or inexperienced question askers. I'm not just going to say journalists because there's people like you could be-
PaQuita: I know, actually therapists.
Lauren: Right? You ask questions for a living.
PaQuita: Uh-huh.
Lauren: And, so, oftentimes, an inexperienced asker can ask questions that lead the witness, as they would say in courtroom.
PaQuita: Absolutely.
Lauren: Or that garner a response because this is the way you're leading someone.
PaQuita: Absolutely.
Lauren: And I just try, I feel like that's always something that I can learn is how do I ask questions better?
PaQuita: Even myself as a therapist and as I train new clinicians, we talk about that all of the time. It's like how do you take a backseat? I think the other thing is when we're translating it. How does it show up in translation as well? Because I think that when you only tell one part of the story it's incomplete, so different things like that.
But questions, I used to ask in my intakes. I used to say, "What was your relationship with your mom growing up?" And I would ask about the whole family and people were like, "It was good. It was fine. It was okay."
Lauren: Really? That's all you'd get?
PaQuita: I'm like, "I know moms have been keeping therapists in business for years." I heard someone else doing this intake shout out to all the moms out there. Dads are keeping us in business too, and partners, and everybody, and children, and everybody. But I heard another clinician ask and she said, "So what was it like having your mom as a mom growing up?"
Lauren: Oh, it hits you different.
PaQuita: That feels different.
Lauren: I felt that differently, actually, I felt it in my stomach.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: Instead of just the way the initial question was asked. I actually thought, I felt it in my head, I thought it.
PaQuita: You thought, yes.
Lauren: But the way you asked it, I felt the answer.
PaQuita: And once I started doing that, people would just start opening up and giving more of those details. And, so, I definitely think it's important how you ask your questions. It's the same with ourselves, too, bringing it back to that scarcity and to that abundance. "Can I afford this car?" Versus, "What would it look like with me having this car?" You know what I mean?
Lauren: Listen to the feeling.
PaQuita: What is the feeling? And, so, getting us into our bodies, getting us into that and really connecting to the essence of what is going on, and let that be our teacher. Versus just the thoughts because the thoughts get twisted.
Lauren: Totally.
PaQuita: They get twisted.
Lauren: So that's why I feel like we have to drop out of our minds just in general. We got to drop into the body-
PaQuita: Mind, body, connect-
Lauren: ...and feel the answer. And I say this a lot because I feel this so intensely. I feel like women are just so perfectly situated to understand how to feel their way through situations. And I think we learn it through life. We learn it with our cycle. We learn it with, "Oh, I don't feel so good. Oh, wait, I'm about to start."
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: We just, consistently, every single month have these reminders of how our bodies tell us what time it is.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: And then I'll tell you I have three children. I've been pregnant three times; I've given birth three times. You have to know your body, and that gets you back into your body and you have to trust yourself in a way that I just don't think men are ever pushed into that situation.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: And it's not so much that like women can do it better. I think it's that women get pushed into the situation all the time, of like, "Well, what's your body saying?"
PaQuita: What is right?
Lauren: And, so, I think we just have more experience dropping into the body.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: Do you see that?
PaQuita: Yes, for sure, I definitely think so. And I think there's some unlearning, and some learning that goes with that. I just met this lady, beautiful lady, with a beautiful story. And she was talking about how she used to have a lot of anxiety about childbirth. And she said, "I had so much anxiety and like I needed to be a rock star." And then she said, "And, then, one day I realized my body knows what to do."
Lauren: Yes, you don't. This has nothing with your head, none of it.
PaQuita: And, so, from that, again, we as women, and thinking about the body. We're always told what we need to be doing with our body or not doing with our body, and then scarcity shows up with that.
Lauren: Mm-hmm.
PaQuita: Then we're not trusting it. But then like you said, it gets our attention, and it's like our bodies knows what to do.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: It knows exactly what to do and it tells us what we need to hear. We just have to start listening to it.
Lauren: I am going to ask you this question, by first reflecting on something that I feel, and I want then your professional opinion on what I'm about to say. I have found that the answer, for me, in a lot of situations as I've gotten older, I never would allow for silence.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: I would never allow for nothing. I wouldn't allow space for nothing, I had to fill all the time. But I've only, recently, this year begun to learn the value in nothing. That something beautiful can come from me just sitting there, me focusing on one thing, me meditating, me being in silence.
And, for me, that has become the answer in, literally, every situation. Well, let's find stillness, let's find silence. And, so, I'm at the place where I'm like, "God, this is for everybody. This is what everybody needs." But I want your professional opinion on that. Is silence, is meditation, is stillness the answer for everyone or is it just the answer for some people?
PaQuita: I think it's the answer for everyone, but I think it looks different for everyone. Meaning, yes, we need stillness, we need nothing, and we need space. So what I hear you saying is creating that space to just be with yourself. To check in with your body. To check in with your emotions. To check in with your thoughts, to get clear.
Lauren: And even ask myself, "Is this what I want?"
PaQuita: Exactly.
Lauren: "Do I want this?"
PaQuita: To lose distraction, so many times we're caught up in stuff because we are distracted. So there are some people, they really struggle with that sitting still, meditation. And, so, you know what, I say, "Well, what about a moving meditation?"
Lauren: Mm-hmm, I'm not a sit still meditator. I actually am a moving meditation.
PaQuita: You have to have moving, and then people say, "Oh, I didn't know that you could do moving meditation." And, so, that's, again, why I say, "Pay attention on purpose." Whatever you're doing, the key thing is, "Are you present?" And, so, when I hear silence, when I hear stillness, when I hear nothing, to me, that's presence. Because you're not, now, filling it with stuff just to fill it with stuff.
Lauren: Because you're nervous or feel the silence sometimes.
PaQuita: Or because you feel like you have to. But sometimes that ears, there is healing in pauses.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: There is healing in pauses. But we have been so conditioned to skip the pause. We don't even have periods anymore, we just have commas in everything that we do, comma and comma, or comma. But it's like, pause, really reflect. So I definitely think that it's for everyone.
One thing that I recommend for my clients and people that I work with, is take 30 minutes of stillness, silence, meditation. So that can look like reading for people, but just stillness, 30 minutes at the start of your day.
Lauren: Oh, yes.
PaQuita: Not in the middle, not after the kids have went to bed, not after you've checked on everyone. But just 30 minutes every morning and watch how things shift for you, that's it, consistently. So I used to have an acronym that I started. I like acronyms and things like that.
Lauren: Do you still remember?
PaQuita: It was called SAVE And, so, I made this up and it was SILENCE. And, so, I'd wake up and I would not check my phone. I would not get on social media, which I am the worst with social media, anyway.
Lauren: Everybody is, don't worry.
PaQuita: I don't even like it, I just do it because it's out there.
Lauren: Same.
PaQuita: So it would be silence, I would not talk to anyone. All of my friends, everyone, knew do not call me between this time and if they did call me, I would not answer. Starting with silence. and then a was AFFIRMATIONS. I've changed that now to what I call Loving-Kindness phrases, because I think affirmations can feel like pretending.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: But Loving-Kindness, phrases are like a goodwill, faith statements. Like;
* May I be happy
* May I be free.
* May I be safe.
* May I be present.
* May I be still.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And, then, V was VISUALIZE. I would visualize what I wanted my day to look like. How I wanted people to treat me. How I wanted to show up. And then E was EXERCISE and I would do my yoga every single morning.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: That sounds like a whole lot, but some of those are intertwined, too.
Lauren: You can do your yoga.
PaQuita: 30 minutes every single day, and when I tell you the stillness actually comes naturally. Or when you are walking across the meadow and you really look at how green the grass is. And you're like, "I've walked across this meadow 10 times in the last three days and I didn't realize how green it was." I used to work at a residential treatment facility in Nunnelly, Tennessee, so it really was a meadow We had cows and all of those different types of things.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: So just being able to move with that lightness.
Lauren: Mm-hmm.
PaQuita: So I know I gave a lot of words to your theme.
Lauren: I love that, though, that acronym is amazing.
PaQuita: But start in the morning, it's hard to be still in the middle of the day for a lot of people. It's hard to be still at night because you're hustling, and bustling, and sometimes there's a fine line between stillness and crashing.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And most people, "Oh, well, I'm going to go be still." And it's like, "No, you're crashing." But when we're crashing, we're not really mindful. Most of the time we want to do something mindless. So start your day, first with those things, even if it's working for you, now, different start it in the morning and watch how things shift.
Lauren: I love that. It's something that I started to do. I did start doing that, recently, and the thing that I could not, I still don't understand how this is even possible. I spend so much time in silence that it has now created new capacity for me.
PaQuita: Mm-hmm.
Lauren: It's also meant that the things that used to take me a certain amount of time take me less time.
PaQuita: Yes.
Lauren: I still don't know how that's possible. That, number one, that I could spend so much time in silence in a day, in meditation. And then, number two, that I can float through the things I need to do, and I am like an arrow.
PaQuita: It increases your capacity.
Lauren: It's unbelievable, to me, and I still don't understand the phenomenon other than like, "Hey, I fully am aware that this is now the byproduct that I don't feel the anxiety. I don't feel the stress or strain of like, 'I have too much. I have too much to do.'" Well, I don't even feel that. I just sort of float through it, get it done in half the time, and "Okay, there's no fanfare, it's done."
Lauren: Yes, absolutely.
PaQuita: I say it takes the theatrics out.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And, so, absolutely, think about, going back to the body, our central nervous system, stress is our response to any demands that we have. But think about it, if we're always stressed, then we're in that flight/fight/freeze mode. Which all flight/fight/freeze cares about is survival.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: That's it. Our limbic system is going off and that's our reptilian brain, you know what I mean? Survive. What do you need to do to get through the day?
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And different things like that. So I think that when we can calm that and really nourish that, and allow it to come on when it needs to. But when we can keep it where it needs to be, all of those other higher level processes that we have, that mammalian brain, is able to really do what it needs to do. It's not being hijacked.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: And, so, sometimes just that soothing, and that breathing, and those things help say, "Okay, limbic system, thank you so very much, but we're actually not in any danger here."
Lauren: Yes, "We're okay, we don't need you."
PaQuita: "We are okay. Thank you, for being on the scene and I understand that you're just trying to protect me. But right now, it's the mammalian turn."
Lauren: I just love that.
PaQuita: So, yes, absolutely. So that's the other thing about that mind, body, connect and a lot of times it gives us perspective. It, also, helps us that mindfulness you holding it in balanced awareness. Too often something happens and we start over-identifying with it, and that takes up space.
Lauren: Yes.
PaQuita: So now it's taking you two hours to complete something because you're bogged down.
Lauren: Totally.
PaQuita: But because you're over-identifying with it. And, so, it's just letting it go, so creating space.
Lauren: Ah, I love it. Dr. P, what a gift, what a joy. Thank you so much for doing this, today, appreciate it.
PaQuita: Yes, thank you for having me.
Lauren: Big thank you, again, to Dr. PaQuita Pullen for showing up as her authentic self for this episode from My Place of Wholeness. I laughed so many times while I was listening back, and editing this episode, it really was such a joy to relive.
I've been thinking a lot about her SAVE acronym, she shared at the end just there. It stands for Silence, Affirmations, or as she explained, goodwill, faith statements, Visualization, and Exercise. And it's such a powerful reminder,
It's something I have committed to do for five days, I'm a few days in. And I say five, and not longer, because I know how my mornings go, quite frankly, and I know how hard it is to find stillness in the morning.
So I'm trying to be honest with myself about what I can actually do and, and see how it changes each of my days. And I encourage you to challenge yourself to do the same thing, and maybe start with three days. Try to do it three days in a row and see how you feel.
Even one minute of mental stillness really can reset you. It doesn't mean you're sitting still either. I like to take 10 minute breaks at the station, where I get up from my desk and I just go outside for a few minutes. It's like a break in between things. And once I make it back to my desk, I've signaled to myself that I can move on to the next thing, and it's fine. You can do it if you just commit to it.
Coming up next week, you're going to meet an OG supporter of AMPstigator. Pache, is a former CEO and executive director in healthcare, nonprofit, and business. She is a power player and she's one of those women who is so incredibly connected. She's also become a dear friend of mine. Her lesson is one of next level connectivity. It's a big picture view of the world. We also talk a ton about giving and the implications of giving.
As you go through this week, I encourage you, shine your light, lead with your heart, and live life purposefully.
I'm Lauren Lowrey and this is AMPstigator.
